Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

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prossett
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Greetings all - hope to soon be a regular on this forum.

I'm looking at a beautiful 1980 230G cabrio. It's an old lady, but with a great body. My plan is to replace the I4 engine with the 5.0 V8 Merc engine, since I would need the power in the sand dunes I would normally drive.

I'd appreciate any comments, advice, warnings, that you may have as I still have not bought it.

The body is in great shape, and the drivetrain appears to also be in very good condition. Speedometer does not work, and the original canvas top is long gone although the metal frame is still available.

Engine runs fine, but stutters badly at idle. Mounts are also not tight and it shudders something horrible. In any case the 4-cylinder does not serve my purposes with an output of 105 HP, 172 Nm @ 3000 torque, so it would have to be replaced.

If it helps, here's the VIN: WDB46021017001558

The plan is to make it into a dune machine, installing the V8 engine, wide rims and 33" tires. I'll have a new canvas top made, too.

What do you think? Any specific things I should check for before buying?

twodogs
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

looks a fun motor for the sun
Twodogs

hus55
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

selam aleykum prossett!!
i like your cabrio,very clean and no rust.thats how my G started,but i went for a diesel conversion because of petrol prices!!you are a lucky man.
why is the front cabin roof like that??does it come off,or was it fitted solid?

anyway,good luck and go for it! you have a great rust free base to work on. MASHALLAH...!

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Yup, rust is not a problem out here. I'm more concerned about the drivetrain or axles. And I need to make sure the engine conversion is feasible and done right.

Any advice or things I should check for?

Right now I'm waiting on permission to change the engine; when/if that comes through I can start in earnest.

Here's the kind of terrain I drive on, and I live right on the edge of the desert.

fixwin38
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

it is a bit like a heart transplant in a ninety year old body.....you would have all the usual aggravation of the wiring for the engine management.fuel delivery..exhaust rerouting plus wheel bearings and probably diff wear...check out the play on the front wheel bearings by rocking the wheels at the top...drop the drain plugs on the diffs and check for grey paste or fine metal deposits..assume it is four speed manual ..again drain the oils and check for metal particles in both gearbox and transfer box ..springs you can see. shocks will be tired unless they have been changed..oh and you will need more cores in the radiator....

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Good points, fixwin.

Wiring I guess I'll have many many dead ends from the donor vehicle's harness. The 230G has not many electronics! It'll be tricky, I'm sure. I'll need wiring diagrams at the bare minimum... where can I source them?

Fuel delivery I assume will mean a switch to fuel injection (now it's carbureted of course) so I'll have to drag over the fuel pump and ECM. If I could find a V8 with carbs that would be ideal, but I don't know if there were any - I've got so much to learn! It's going to be fabulous!!! There are many 1980-90 Mercedes engines available here, quite cheap, too - which one would you recommend for the easiest swap plus maintenance in a dusty environment?

Exhaust re-routing will be easy - plenty of capable welders and I don't have emissions to worry about. I might just go for two straight pipes out through lightweight mufflers. No need for cats.

Differentials scare me, though. If one of them goes I'll be in big trouble. I doubt I can find used axles, and a rebuild is beyond me. I'd have to sell both my daughters to have the dealer do it - so it would either be an attempt to swap in a Toyota axle, or simply abandon.. :cry:

Wheel bearings and fluid changes I can do, and certanly will before I drive anywhere.

Shocks, yes, I'll probably have to pay the dealer for them, unless there are aftermarket options, but I can install those myself. Springs should be fine, and with the 33" tires I plan for, which are run at low psi anyways, the suspension won't bother me much. I'd rather not lift to keep the centre of gravity low. It won't go at speed on highways as it will be my second mainly-desert car (plus for my commute!) - I would like to find wider rims if possible, too.

I'm open to all ideas and suggestions.

fixwin38
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Hi I cannot source a Merc V8 that is not mated to an automatic G box.or you might look at going auto as well.by the way your G was originally suppled new to a MB dealer in Qatar.rgds

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Do you mean it's easier to install engine + gear box as one piece, rather than wrestle an old engine onto the existing bell housing? Or is it just easier to find the engine gear box combo rather than just an engine?

I'd prefer to keep the manual gears, if possible; but if auto is the best way forward I'll do that.

As I get closer to the actual swap, I'll have a million and one questions for you all - appreciate your support, and am actually very impressed with the GWOA forums, some really good knowledge being shared here!

My next step is getting the permission for the engine swap from the Police. Once I have that essential paper, I'll start researching in earnest.

Any specific weaknesses I should check for before I buy? Some idiosyncracy particular to the early Gs?

peter perfect
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Prossett, lose the manual gearbox, if its in good nick and four speed you will get a good price for it, overseas. Mate an early 5.0 ltr complete with auto box, it will take up alot of torque that would normally destroy the manual, also auto is better for sand, trying to change gear up a sand dune with a manual will lose you momentum, with auto the car will keep going forward, as you can change down manually.

You can use the 560 engine as well, which has another 30 BHP, I have a 560 in mine. Dont worry about diffs or the transfer box, the auto box will take up most of the strain. The downside is the engine will rev very high at 60-70mph due to the diff ratios. It wont be a high speed car but a very capable off roader. you can use the manifolds of the saloon car or make new ones and you can either fabricate engine mounts or buy the G500 mounts, which are expensive. As long as you have the ecu from the saloon your fine.

fixwin38
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Hi what ever you do you are going to B'''stdize it. why not find some Yank lump with a manual box that fits in the available hole. you can cut and shunt the prop shaft to the transfer box. if the fans in the way fit electric.you could make it into quite an angry beast...you don't have the rust gremlin but you do have the sand ..bad for bearings and worse for cylinder wear.. best of luck with project

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

:lol: My last project was a Yank lump - beauty of an 83 GMC 1/2 tonne, V8 of course, sounded the sweetest thang ever... except for what my V8 G will sound like 8) Nah, might be bastardized, but it'll be pure Merc metal, mate!

Auto sounds fine, I don't particularly mind (and you're right, no shifting on the climb, loses too much momentum, even downshifting) and I especially appreciate the comment on absorbing torque - good point.

60-70mph high revs might be flattened out a bit by the 33" tyres I plan to run, but in any case it's not what I need it for. My family car does the highway trips.

The cooling system will have to be volcano proof, no doubt about that. And no funky high-flow exposed cone filters, either! I'm not out to build a crazy dune racer that loses pieces as it fights up a dune - it'll keep its stock look as much as possible, and will look respectable and civilized. There's nothing worse than sacrificing reliability to gain a few ponies in my book.

My two previous projects, built, enjoyed, and now sold: 93 Wrangler, and 83 GMC next to a mate's 92 Nissan (is it OK to post non-G pics? I'll remove the faux-pas if required)

mgrays
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Skip the yank lump... Lexus V8 .. heaps over in Sharjah for £2-300 I could show you but they all come with auto box.. that is the hard bit.. manual box + V8 is a rare beast in any brand .. Toyota Supra/Landcruiser gearbox + Lexus would work and the box is 500hp proof. In fact a Landcruiser combo would be the easiest and there are a few out there on Dune bashing duty (and then hard to keep up with on roads!); know of a Russian in Dubai who could source one... Staying pure with Benz would be hard unless you can find a panel van manual box that fits a V8 bellhousing.. and then find the flywheel/clutch to match... doable but a little more head scratching.

(spend 18mths in Dubai planning car building.. so I know that patch)

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Unfortunately, I yesterday was unable to secure Police permission for the conversion, even when I had all the required documentation, including the support of the Mercedes agency. The Head of Police agreed all was in order, but he refered me to Abu Dhabi (capital city, about 1.5 hours away) to the Ministry of Interior for their approval. Basically, that means no. :(

So, no V8 G-Wagen for this sad puppy... my search continues for my next project. If it's a G, I'll be back! Great site you've got here!!

peter perfect
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

why do you have to ask the police for permission ?

marcus
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Is Dubai not where a lot of the organised crime car "ringing" goes on, there was an expose on TV, tax free compounds at the docks/official intrangisance etc.mostly to do with high end British stuff going to Japan and visa-versa.
So why so sticky about a wee engine change ?
Marcus

prossett
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

The dodgy stuff is with import/re-export cars, and yes, the used car market is huge passing through Sharjah - from Japan to Russia, from Europe to Middle Eastern countries - it's really big business.

I don't know how much is dodgy, naive as I am I would say it's all legal.

As for UAE-registered cars, the rules are actually very strict on modifications. Emissions are no problem, but engine mods, or actually even roof racks, can be a big problem. Even getting a dent fixed requires Police permission, as does any sort of painting.

So changing the number of cylinders is a big no-no. However, since I had the Merc dealer's letter, and a model where a V8 does actually fit in properly, I was hopeful.

Do keep in mind, though, that the rules don't exactly apply to everyone the same way. There are also plenty of modified cars, and what some do is take everything off and get it back to stock for the yearly inspection. Others don't have to bother about inspections. And then there are morons like me who think that following due procedures is the way forward...

mgrays
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Re: Thinking of Buying: 1980 230G in UAE

Abu Dhabi are obviously more strict than Dubai (both seperate Emirates in UAE ... thing sort of Scotland/England/Wales/N.Ireland with their own head families who cooperate in a sucessful way.)

I was thinking of a V8 into a 4 cylinder.. and I had not come up against the police in my investigations. You either need local contacts or the easy route would be Fujairah (another Emirate, poorer and more um .. flexible!) but I think you need it to be registered by a local Fujairian and insurance gets odd... I do know of someone doing this with a RHD converted to LHD Subaru which is strictly a no no in Dubai.

And Dubai does have interesting bits going on .. go look at number of RHD ex Japan cars with driver door locks missing in the second hand market and then ask about importing them into Europe .. not all but 20-30% will not be clean enough as the chassis number will turn up on police records in Euroland. Likewise the Russian was stuffing 3 full sized Landcruisers into a 20' container by cutting them into 3 .. then rewelding together and converting to LHD for export to his motherland .. very very well done but scary strength afterwards!

Oh and head of Dubai has 3 black lwb G's as his top transport .. do not want no locals driving "our" car do we!!

Alternatives.. turbocharge that engine.. easy enough to double the power and that does keep inside the UAE system, Nitrous was available but again seems a locals only ... but off road who cares.