Gearbox manufacturer
Hi all, does any one know who makes the gearboxes for MB? Specifically the manual 6 speeds in the likes of C classes etc. Is it ZF, Getrag or MB themselves? Cheers Scott.
Hi Scott
As far as i am aware but not 100% most Manuel boxes are MB own make now...
Which particular box are you wanting to know about?
In the 80's and before, a lot of the manual boxes were ZF
with the odd Getrag in the Higher performance models.
If you have the 711.xxx 717.xxx i can find out i think,
most Auto boxes are MB's own from forever with the odd Allison box for good measure
I would say any Auto box in a G will be MB, any post 90's manual in a G will be MB, any 80's boxes starting with
711.xxx will probably be ZF, any 80's boxes starting with 717.xxx will be MB
Confused..hahaha....as with MB there is never a straight forward answer
Hi Scott
I would definiately put that as an MB manufactured 6 speed manual from a 906 chassis Sprinter.
Also fitted to the Jeep Liberty and Wrangler, Chrysler Crossfire and Dodge Nitro.
It is a NSG 370 input rated at 370Nm
NSG370 Specs
Make: Daimler
Type: Manual
1st 5.014
2nd 2.831
3rd 1.789
4th 1.256
5th 1.00
6th 0.828
Reverse 4.569
Max Torque Input: 272ft-lb / 370Nm
Weight: 89.3lbs / 40.5kg
Length: 23.5" - 24.8"
Height: 18"
Case: Cast Aluminum
PTO Port: Possible
Fluid Capacity: 3.75 pints / 1.9 quarts
Fill / Drain Plug: 14mm Allen / 17mm Allen
The NSG370 six-speed Manual transmission provides optimal shift quality, improved quietness and high quality. For smooth operation the First and Second gears have triple-cone synchronization, the Third and Fourth gears feature double-cone and the Fifth and Sixth gears single-cone synchronization. Hard-finished gears allow for quiet operation. A multi-rail, steel-construction shift system delivers high strength and precision. The two-piece aluminum case with integrated clutch housing assures powertrain stiffness and light weight. The new First-gear ratio combined with six-speed step spread allows optimization of axle ratios for fuel economy and performance.
The NSG370 does not use standard gear oil for lubrication. This transmission utilizes bronze synchronizer collars resulting in sensitivity to lubricant make-up. Only a fluid characterized by MB sheet specification 235.10 should be used in order to avoid premature wear or failure of internal parts as well as voiding the factory warranty, the MB part number for the oil is A001 989 26 03.
The Sprinter lists 5 different manual boxes as below...
710.510 ZF 6S-450
711.651 NSG 370
711.660 NSG 400
711.680 TSG 360
711.685 TSG 480
Hope as usual this helps
Gav
interesting report gavin. so the c class 6 speed gearbox is also used in the spinter then ?
axel606 also runs a 6 speed gearbox and he has put it on my top priority list to convert my cabrio to a 6 speed too.
gavin, could you share the tech spec on the other 6 speed manauls too , like the c 220 cdi 6 speed gear ratios, the 270 cdi 6 speed manual gear ratios. it would be a great help.
rgds hus.
Hi Huss
Since you asked so nicely i will get on with it....
A little confused though this end....
Scott's request was for a 711.651 which as far as i am aware is the NSG370 from the Sprinter
and doesn't fit in that format to the PC model's?
Having had a quick look the mistake could be simple as i find a 203 chassis C220CDI runs a 716.651 SG-S370/6.1
the difference 711.651 to 716.651 could be a typo on Scott's behalf? and it may be the PC box he wants?
The boxes are very similar anyway?
Which one do you all want?
Gav
Hi Gavin and Huss
Definitely 711 651, it's stamped on it, I just need to know who makes them because I'm trying to find diagrams of the internals to see whether or not I can fit a reverse detent spring inside. I'm assuming the box is made for many vehicles, not just MB, and other car manufacturers don't have the reverse lockout at the gear lever like MB, so usually have something inside the gearbox.
Here's some more info
MB 711.117 - T=? - 1st=4.695, 2nd=2.401, 3rd=1.436, 4th=1, 5th=0.806..4.078
MB 711.116 - T=? - 1st=6.157, 2nd=3.148, 3rd=1.743, 4th=1.278, 5th=1, R=5.347 - Rem=No syncro on 1st
Getrag 717.439 - T=? - 1st=3.856, 2nd=2.182, 3rd=1.365, 4th=1, 5th=0.799, R=4.218
MB 722.3 Auto - T=? - 1st=3.871, 2nd=2.247, 3rd=1.436, 4th=1, R=5.586 - Rem=Here for comparision
Sprinter or E/C Class
MB 711.620 G32-5 - T=? - 1st=5.05, 2nd=2.6, 3rd=1.52, 4th=1, 5th=0.78, R=4.76 - Rem=Sprinter 2000+
NSG 370 Jeep - T=272, 1st=4.46, 2nd=2.61, 3rd=1.72, 4th=1.25, 5th=1, 6th=0.84, R=4.06 - Rem=Chrysler 4dr Jeep
NSG 370, 711.651 - T=272 - 1st5.014, 2nd=2.831, 3rd=1.789, 4th=1.256, 5th=1, 6th=0.828, R=4.569 Rem=Sprinter/ML CDI
NSG 400, 711.660 - T=? - 1st=5.453, 2nd=2.974, 3rd=1.873, 4th=1.332, 5th=1, 6th=0.777, R=4.946 Rem=Sprinter from 2009, has PTO
MB 711.670 - T=? - 1st=5.1, 2nd=2.78, 3rd=1.75, 4th=1.25, 5th=1, 6th=0.81, R=? - Rem=E/C Class CDI from 2008???
Ford ZF - Fx50 series - needs adapter plate
ZF S6 650 - T=520 - 1st=5.79, 2nd=3.3, 3rd=2.1, 4th=1.31, 5th=1, 6th=0.72, R=5.23 Rem=Ford, 6sp, ZF
ZF S5 47 - T=470 - 1st=5.72, 2nd=2.94, 3rd=1.61, 4th=1, 5th=0.76, R=5.24 - Rem=Ford 5sp, ZF
ZF S5 47 - T=470 - 1st=5.08, 2nd=2.61, 3rd=1.53, 4th=1, 5th=0.77, R=4.66........Ford 5sp, ZF
ZF S5 47 - T=470- 1st=4.14, 2nd=2.37, 3rd=1.42, 4th=1, 5th=0.77, R=3.79.......Ford 5sp, ZF
Hi Scott
I have access to all internal diagrams as far as parts goes
Can you give me the complete Gearbox number i.e. including the serial number i.e 711.651.??.??????
The plate should also have a part number punched in it either starting A or X
If you can get me these i can back track it to the vehicle it can out of and supply you with detailed parts drawings
Gav
Awesome! Ok, should be able to get the numbers tomorrow. Thanks Gavin.
cheers scott and gavin !
wonder what the ratios are for the 270 cdi 6 speed manual ? or did i miss it....
which one in the diagram was the one used on the c220 cdi..?
thanks in advance...
rgds hus
Hi Scott
So what your trying to establish is?
The box when fitted in the Sprinter, has a reverse lock out built into the shift mechanism?
Now your fitting it to a G, the G lever does not have this facility? and you cant use the Sprinter shift mech
Other vehicles using this box also dont have this facility at the shift mech?
What mods are done to the box internals in these other vehicles to install a reverse lock out?
Or am i way off the mark? with my very limited mechanical knowledge
Hi Huss
Sorry they were Scott's ratios not mine, looks like from his own home work while trying to establish the decision you are now looking at
I have had a quick look but really either need more info on which exact model your looking at i.e 716.651 or need a bit deeper look into it as there are lots of versions of the SG-S370 fitted to 200CDI 220CDI 270CDI C CLASS E CLASS CLK CLASS etc etc including VITO and more
Cheers
Gav
i am looking at a gearbox off a 2003/4 270 cdi or possibly a 220 cdi of the same era... ratios would help establish what sort of performance could be had.
i really want the 6th gear more refined cruising, but i dont want to loose the highly superior off road performance i have right now !!
its all swings and roundabouts !
rgds hus
Hi Gavin, yes, you're spot on. I could use a sprinter/car shift mechanism but I'm trying to make it more simple by having the reverse lock out in the box. I figured that because these 'boxes are used in many other vehicles, maybe it has provision for this. Regards Scott.
Hi Huss
You will get used to my short answers over time……get a brew on….
The SG-S370/6.1 is fitted to most of the 4 – 5 – 6 cylinder CDI engine cars and vans in the MB Range between 2000 and today that utilise a 6 speed manual gearbox plus a few others petrol models. There is however other 6 speed boxes fitted to these models depending on spec etc. SG-S400 … NSG400 … NSG510 etc.
As for specific gear ratio’s, as you can see this is a bit of an issue as versions of the box can be specific to 220cdi or 270cdi but some are fitted into both 220cdi and 270cdi with the same ratio?
Catch 22 really as to which one you want but I guess rule of thumb depends on the engine your fitting. i.e. a 4 cylinder OM604na may want a 716.640, a 5 cylinder OM605na may want a 716.656, a 5 cylinder OM605LA and 6 cylinder OM606na may want a 716.648, and a 6 cylinder OM606LA may want a 716.653? These are just examples and not fact!!!
It’s a bit of a mine field really as to what you have available? Somebody might say that any 6 speed will be a better option than a standard 4 or 5 speed manual gearboxes!!!
They can be found in the following model ranges…
210 E CLASS SALOONS – ESTATES
203 C CLASS SALOONS – ESTATES - SPORT COUPES
163 ML CLASS SUVS
209 CLK CLASS COUPES - CABRIOS
204 C CLASS SALOONS - ESTATES - SPORT COUPES
204 GLK CLASS XOVER SUVS
211 E CLASS SALOONS - ESTATES
172 SLK CLASS CONVERTABLES
212 E CLASS SALOONS - ESTATES
207 E CLASS COUPE CABRIOS
639 VITO VANS
901/2/3/4 SPRINTER VANS
Just be aware that some of these are also available with the “Sprint Shift” Sequentronic (Sales code 424) set up and are in general a much more complicated and unnecessary option when retro fitting to something else.
The specific BauMuster for the SG-S370/6.1… most options are below but not all….
716.640 SG-S370/6.1 C220CDI W/T/CL203 E220CDI W/T210 OM611 4 cylinder
716.641 SG-S370/6.1 E270CDI W/T210 OM612 5 cylinder
716.643 SG-S370/6.1 208/308/408CDI 211/311/411CDI 213/313/413CDI 216/316/416CDI 901/2/3/4/Sprinter OM611 4 cylinder OM612 5 cylinder
716.644 SG-S370/6.1 ML270CDI W163 OM612 5 cylinder
716.646 SG-S370/6.1 E280CDI W/T211 OM642 6 cylinder
716.647 SG-S370/6.1 C220CDI W/T/CL203 E220CDI W/T210 OM611 4 cylinder
716.648 SG-S370/6.1 C270CDI W/T203 E270CDI W/T210 OM612 5 cylinder
716.649 SG-S370/6.1 C220CDI W/T/CL203 C270CDI W/T203 CLK270CDI C209 E220CDI W210 W/T211 OM646 4 cylinder OM612 5 cylinder OM611 4 cylinder OM646 4 cylinder
716.651 SG-S370/6.1 C220CDI W/T/CL203 E220CDI W/T210 OM611 4 cylinder OM646 4 cylinder
716.652 SG-S370/6.29 109CDI 110CDI 111CDI 113CDI 115CDI 116CDI 120CDI 122CDI 119 123 126 639 Vito V350 2.0 2.2 3.0 3.2 3.5 639 Viano M112 6 cylinder M272 6 cylinder OM642 6 cylinder OM646 4 cylinder OM651 4 cylinder
716.653 SG-S370/6.1 C320CDI W/T203 CLK320CDI C/A209 E280CDI W/T211 OM642 6 cylinder
716.654 SG-S370/6.1 C220CDI W/T/CL203 C270CDI W/T203 CLK220CDI CLK270CDI C209 E200CDI W/T211 OM646 4 cylinder OM612 5 cylinder
716.656 SG-S370/6.1 C180CDIBE C200CDI C200CDIBE C220CDI C220CDIBE C250CGI C250CGIBE W/T204 E200CDI W/T212 OM651 4 cylinder M271 4 cylinder
Key…
M = Motor (Petrol)
OM = Oil Motor (Diesel)
W = Saloon
T = Estate
CL = Sport Coupe
C = Coupe
A = Cabriolet
OM611 = 4 Cylinder CDI Euro3
OM612 = 5 Cylinder CDI Euro3
OM646 = 4 Cylinder CDI Euro4
OM651 = 5 Cylinder CDI Euro5
OM642 = V6 Cylinder CDI Euro4/5
M112 = V6 Cylinder
M271 = 4 Cylinder
M272 = V6 Cylinder
This website may be of use or interest whilst digging for information…
http://interparts.me/modelCatSearch.do?fc=1&catalogId=8
If you pick up a specific gearbox or have an option on one, if you get me the full serial number i.e. 716.640 xx XXXXXX I should be able to find the donor chassis number and the specific gear ratio’s for you.
One importent note refers to the 716.652 option that list SG-S370/6.29 which is different to the rest, this is the version fitted to the Vito / Viano Van, interestingly these are available with an AWD 4x4 option from the factory and may be an ideal option for our purpose? I have never seen a 4x4 in the flesh but the gearbox is listed as an option right across the Vito range?
Hope this helps in some way and not confuses you even more!
Gav
So the best way forward is to try and match the power and torque characteristics of your current engine [mine is a m103 with a 5 speed manual box] as closely as is possible to one of the examples listed. The most appropriate for me I think would be the manual gearbox fitted to the 230k M111.947 in for example the 1st generation slk as this mirrors my engines output fairly closely?
Hi Gavin, here's all the numbers
711.651
9062601000
MB R2112611701
stig, i am using near identical box in my pickup nrs. 211 260 74 00 716-651 01 396 809 / r 210 261 06 01
it is from a clk c class 220 cdi you will need the shifter mechanism for this car and then cut it down to fit the g ,i have done this already with my lwb it shifts v nice and slick, i do not know why you are fixated with the sprinter shifter??
you will need the flywheel and clutch complete and the clk clutch master cylinder to make this all work
please come on open w end to learn more this is not for beginners but the results are impressive with the driving experience.
the gearbox uses a constant contact release bearing and not a conventional slave /release arm thrust bearing assembly the hydraulics use a totally different ratio master cylinder/ slave setup please be careful if you have only basic knowledge the flywheel is over 440 £ alone then you need a clutch......
all these gearboxes are strong and the lower rated ones are ok just fill them with a high quality shock proof oil from opie oils etc and it will be fine ,remember these boxes are rated to last a lifetime of rated torque with no failures they have a large margin of safety designed in to them.
a final note ,the old fordson major of the 1950's- 60's came with a 45hp diesel engine ,the geartrain can take over 600+bhp with a monster turbo diesel for tractor pulling with no mods whatsoever and they 'stick it ' in what is the most drivetrain unfriendly abuse you can dish out ..... so do not get too fixated with torque ratings they are tough boxes.
Hi Axel
I already have this box in the G and operating, and yes it's very good. I have a car shifter working in it already, but I don't like it.
It's not good to have the shifter as part of the body, as it cannot move with the drive train and this can lead to it pulling itself out of gear if jolted hard enough, and the gear lever moves whenever the transmission twists or moves fore/aft. With cables this won't happen of course because effectively the shifter is part of the transmission, not the body, that's why it's done that way. The old rod system of the older boxes is different as the shift levers are at the side of the 'box, making them not so exposed to movement related problems, and the shifting throw is a lot larger than the newer 'boxes with just one shifter rod at the rear top.
I am making the shift system part of the gearbox itself (just like the C shifters are normally, ie, connected to the top of the gearbox, but I don't want it's cable part for the gate selection), that way there is never problems with movement of drive train or body, there is no vibration noise transmitted, and it's just a whole lot better and how it should be. But, the system I will use, which is A LOT more simple than the Merc shifter doesn't have a reverse lock out bult in to the shifter. This is not a problem as I can make something, but, I thought, that maybe the gearbox itself already has provision for this if they are used for other applications.
My clutch is SACHS 3000 824 202, 19mm Master cylinder, you can use a BMW flexi hose which will go straight in to the slave cylinder and connect to the original G steel pipe from the master cylinder with a simple adapter. BMW hose part No. is 21526775008.
Hope this clarifies what I'm up to, and maybe is of some help.
Regards Scott
sounds like you are on top of the job,i have not had any problems with the moving about and jumping out of gear, you can make the stabliser frame fit the 6 speeder with a bit of fiddling ,my linkage works fine with a nice shift, it has one cable for side to side and a small flexible joint for isolation for back and forth ,good luck with your job it should be really nice, the shift on the 6 speeders is so superior to the old 5 speeders
Hi Scott
Unfortunatly the bit i need is missing?
Axel posted this info for his box .... 211 260 74 00 716-651 01 396 809 / r 210 261 06 01
Which equates to
Part Number A211 260 74 00
Gearbox BM 716.651
Gearbox serial no 01 396 809
Casing Number R2102610601
You posted ...... 711.651 9062601000 MB R2112611701
Which equates to
Part Number A906 260 10 00
Gearbox BM 711.651
Gearbox serial no ???
Casin Number R2112611701
Hope you can find the missing data as its the bit i need!!!
Gav
Hi Axel, thanks, I'll keep you updated on it all, would be good to share good and bad.
Regards Scott
Gavin- I'll have another look...
Hi Axel
Yes your gearbox has come from vin number WDB203.206.2F 201715 a 2001 C220CDI Avantgarde Estate which was fitted with the 4 cylinder OM611 2148cc engine pumping out 105kw or 140hp at the flywheel.
As your comments above, the engineered in "margin" for torque rating and power outputs is huge on these boxes and that should have no trouble coping with anything a OM60X engine can throw at it, in standard or a mild state of tune.
Gav
This gearbox is as it says from a....
MB CLK 200 Kompressor C/A209 2004 Petrol Manual 6 Speed
Chassis Type 209.341 Coupe or 209.441 Cabrio fitted with M271 1.8 Supercharged Petrol Engine with pumping out 120kw or 161hp at the flywheel.
CASING PART NO: A203 261 05 01
GEARBOX PART NO: A203 260 97 00
TYPE: SG-S270/5.3
MODEL BM: 716.628 or
MODEL BM: 716.631
I understand that the starter motor is on the right side (or left actually)but as to actual fitment etc i will leave it upto the professionals on here. Your 300GE G300 M103 would have figures of 126kw or 169hp from factory. So not too far removed from where this is at?
Hope this helps
Gav
Thanks, the existing 5th gear is not really an overdrive so having a 6th might improve economy. Mine is a 1991 car so I have deleted the cat and fitted a k&n and a shortened exhaust so I believe its chucking out a tad more than the factory figures would suggest but well within the parametres of that gearbox.
hi gavin.
i stumbled across a sprinter gearbox today and its being offered to me complete clutch flywheel etc..for avery reasonable price.
the code numbers are as follows ;
G 20 - 5
AGGR NR 711 605
FORTL- NR 714604
VAR - NR/ NA 100178
whats the tech spec mate ? and whats it out of ?
i would really love a 6 speed but would like to see comparisons between this and a
AGGR NR 711-612 G-28 - 5 this is from a sprinter 312 2.9 td 97 model. which is better suited to the G?
kind regards
hus55
Hi Huss
You like these tricky questions….
That Gearbox number 711 605 02 714604 came from a 2000 model year 208CDI Sprinter.
UK spec RHD vehicle built in Dusseldorf and mated to a 4 cylinder OM611.987 engine,
and it was running circa 82hp from its 2.2ltrs.
The chassis number was WDB 901 661 2R 140286.
The part number for the box is X002 100 178 and is model number G20-5/4.8
So this is just a standard 5 speed manual box.
This is virtually the same box as the 711 612 from the 312D which is just
an earlier version albeit in uprated spec.
These are the 901/902/903/904 Sprinter gearbox versions…..
Early type from 1995 up to 1999
711.603 208/308/408D OM601 G16-5 circa 80hp
711.612 210/310/410D OM602A G28-5 circa 100hp
711.612 212/312/412D OM602A G28-5 circa 120hp
Later type from 1999 up to 2006
711.605 208-308-408CDI OM611A G20-5 circa 80hp
711.620 211-311-411CDI OM611A G32-5 circa 110hp
711.620 213-313-413CDI OM611A G32-5 circa 130hp
711.620 216CDI/316CDI/416CDI OM612A G32-5 circa 160hp
These are all 5 speed manual gear boxes
Did you think the 711.605 was a 6 speed box?
Only the 2006 on 906 chassis Sprinter was fitted with the 6 speeder
Let me know if you want me to look for the ratio’s etc.
Gav
hi gav.
your a star mate !
whats the info on this one ?
G 35 - 5
AGGR NR 711 620
FORTL- NR 765329
VAR - 100179.
whats the ratios on this box ?
i have a chance to get a 6 speeder too. which is meant to be much more quieter and has good 6th gear for crusing and low 1st.
look forward to your light on the matter.
rgds hus
Good god Huss !! How many gear boxe can one look at ??/ Watch it Gav this could go on forever !!!!! :-)
Anyway Huss I am away to marmaris tomorrow, are you far from there ?? Could met up and discuss gear boxes :-)
Hi Huss
You know i love it .... lol!!!
This came from a 2000 model year RHD 313cdi chassis number WDB 903 663 2R 177482 fitted with the same OM611 engine but the OM611.981 version putting out 129hp from its 2.2ltr. Gearbox number is 711 620 00 765329 and the part number is X002 100 179. The model is actually a G32-5/5.0. This vehicle was supplied from Dusseldorf to Gibraltar country code 551.
Ratios are as follows
5-speed manual, Ratio: 1st gear 5.053, 2nd 2.601, 3rd 1.521, 4th 1.0, 5th 0.784, Reverse 4.756
Hope this helps
Gav
Hi Fred
I think he actually has a gearbox fetish ;)
He is building up to his favorite one.....
You shoud have pulled the box out of Mark's 4x4 Sprinter last weekend and stuck it in your suitcase :)
Nice to meet you briefly at the AGM
Gav
Hi Gav,
Shame on me, i'd never establish the link between the Gav at agm and yourself !!!! Apologises mate.
Good to meet too :-)
Hope we catch up soon ...
Fred
hi fred. i am doing a thorough search mate. i cant keep changing ideas and gearbox's every few years.
i am going to follow stig on this one.
btw, have a great time in marmaris, BUT DO NOT MENTION FOOTBALL OUT THERE !
RGDS HUS
That's cool...
I try to keep a low profile and also to stay away from that big Green machine you were driving!
It scares me.....haha
ordered the 6 speed manual sprinter box gav inc all the trimmings.
should be here in a few weeks then we get stuck in with the conversion.
btw gav, how many types of 6 speed manuals are there for the sprinter ? been told mine is off a 2008 model.
rgds hus
Does that mean i get my life back....lol ;)
Give me the box number when you get it and i will give you the details etc
Depending on what model of 906 Sprinter it came from then as follows...
710.510 ZF 6S-450 sales code GE0 RARE - NEVER SEEN ONE!!!
711.651 NSG370 sales code GD1 EURO4 OM646 I4
711.660 NSG400 sales code GD7 EURO4 OM642 V6
711.680 TSG360 sales code GD8 ECO SHIFT EURO5 OM651 I4
711.685 TSG480 sales code GD9 ECO SHIFT EURO5 OM642 V6
Reckon you should be getting a 711.651 NSG370 from a 2008 vehicle?
Gav
morning gavin,
i will will let you know when the box arrives. i have a feeling its off a 2008 sprinter.
rgds hus
This is an old thread but I've been trawling the net to find more info on transmissions without much luck.
Gav, I hope you can give me more detail on some transmissions I have found and I want to buy one of them for my OM606 conversion into a RHD 463 300GD.
Here are the numbers on the transmissions:
203 260 9700 716 628 01 584 314 – 203 961 0501
212 260 0301 716 657 02 434 207 – 211 261 0901
211 260 5900 716 648 01 624 305 – 211 261 0901
211 260 4801 716 654 01 996 106 - 211 261 0901
At the moment I'm thinking the 716.657 is my favorite coming out of a W212 which all seem to have a torque rating of 370Nm upwards for the diesels. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_W212
Not sure yet if it will fit, but I will get that info from Axel (Mike) hopefully.
Thanking you in advance,
Alan
Give me a day and i will report back to you Alan
Gav
716.654 or 651 or 716.606 complete with shift linkage ,flywheel and clutch and clutch master cylinder and the correct gearknob . the .654 and .606 have reverse in different places and have a different shifter linkage .both work well in a g .they are not plug and play you have to engineer the solution.
all the boxes are strong , i run a 716.630 from a 230 kompressor in my lwb g doing heavy towing and hard driving IT DOES NOT BREAK..
Thanks a mil Gav.
Take your time I'm off for a long weekend.
Hi Alan
Me too....
I have the info if you want to PM me your email address .... lots of it!!!
Gav
PM sent, thanks.
Lets cut to the chase here
Axel persuaded me to fit a 6 speed to my latest 461/662 project although I am a 5 speed man myself
Last 3 diits stamped on raised boss are torque related
You cannot hurt these wonderful silky shifting boxes ,we try every day
Hi,
I'm a new member in forum. Do you think i can change a gearbox 716.649 by 716.651 for my C220-W203-2003, with number VIN: WDB2030081A571309?
Thanks for yours reply,
Best regards,
I have read some of this massive post, all very interesting
Many good points and also Gavs total up to date in depth info on all gearboxes. Hes a credit to GWOA and has helped me with parts more than enough.Top man
Right down to basics
Simply put so easy to understand. All 6 speed mercedes gearboxes have a lower final drive speed than 5 speed boxes as far as i know
Mercedes 5 speeds have a final drive output of about 0.54 to 0.57. Without checking in depth 6 speed boxes will have a final drive of i think 0.77 or more
So fitting a 6 speed will not give you an overdrive effect. You will end up with a very short 1st gear and top ie 6th gear will mean you are actually lower geared than most 5 speed boxes so more revs less speed more fuel
I have tried many boxes in my g wagon. The petrol gearboxes are not for a g wagon due to the contant weight and torque it has to endure. The c180 6 speed did ok but a lot of gearboxes do not have the angle of lean some g wagon engines have. No problem just overfill oil a bit before fitment
Best boxes are diesel boxes as bearings and all shafts are almost double the petrol variant sizes.
My 220 cdi box i have rebuilt thats straight forward and all bearings and seals are so cheap from mercedes.
The later 2007 boxes are the best and easiest to fit as they have no cable assist. I have 2 older type boxes from 220 cdi models if anyone need any and the linkage which obviously you need to modify
Let me know if anyone has a 220 cdi 2007 onwards box as i need one for a project
Hope this all helps. So to cap it off. I wish i rebuilt my 5 speed but bearings were expensive and also i had some axles that were very high geared so the 6 speed works fine and 6th gear is like overdrive and you need to be doing about 60mph to get it happy enough to pull the g along as now its very high geared. Be warned as 6 speeds are lower geared than most 5 speeds as i said. Dont fit and think you will be better off with a 6th speed high/tall geared overdrive as ou will be lower geared if anything
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Hi Gavin
It's a 2010 711.651, does that help?
Cheers Scott